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„Ein Nein muss immer akzeptiert werden!“

In der vorigen Ausgabe haben wir mit Mag. Wolfgang Kostenwein, Psychologische Leitung des Österreichischen Instituts für Sexualpädagogik, bereits über Aufklärung und Sex gesprochen. Im zweiten Teil unseres Interviews widmen wir uns unter anderem Pornos und Leistungsdruck.

Von 25. November bis 10. Dezember läuft jährlich die internationale Kampagne „16 Tage gegen Gewalt an Frauen und Mädchen“. Wir haben anlässlich dieser Aktion die Geschäftsführerin der österreichischen Frauenhelpline gegen Gewalt, Mag.a Maria Rösslhumer, zum Interview gebeten.


Cool: Wie ist in Österreich die aktuelle Situation mit Gewalt an Frauen und Mädchen?

Mag.a Maria Rösslhumer: Jede fünfte Frau ab dem 15. Lebensjahr ist mindestens einmal in ihrem Leben von körperlicher oder sexueller Gewalt betroffen. Das sind rund 20 Prozent. Das ist ein hoher Anteil und deshalb auch sehr erschreckend. Vor allem viele junge Frauen sind schon davon betroffen, sehr häufig von ihrem Freund oder Partner.

Cool: So viele Mädchen werden vergewaltigt oder geschlagen oder was darf man sich darunter vorstellen?

Mag.a Maria Rösslhumer: Sexuelle Gewalt beginnt eigentlich schon damit, frauenverachtende, sexistische Witze über ein bestimmtes Mädchen zu machen. Oder wenn Burschen in der Öffentlichkeit erzählen, was die Frau im Bett nicht alles macht und sie dadurch bloßstellen und erniedrigen. Wenn man Gewalt an Frauen und Mädchen hört, denken die meisten vor allem an physische Gewalt, aber psychische oder verbale Gewalt werden oft nicht wahrgenommen. Vergewaltigung ist das Schlimmste und Äußerste einer sehr breiten Bandbreite der Gewalt.

Cool: Wie kommt es zu dieser Gewalt?

Mag.a Maria Rösslhumer: Das beginnt häufig vermeintlich harmlos. Es kann zum Beispiel sein, dass der Freund sehr eifersüchtig ist oder beim kleinsten Konflikt gleich wütend wird. Burschen neigen oftmals auch dazu, dass sie den Mädchen vorschreiben was sie anziehen sollen, wie sexy sie in der Öffentlichkeit zu sein haben und mit welchen Freunden oder Familienmitgliedern sie sich treffen „dürfen“. In diesem Spannungsfeld zwischen Liebe, Verboten und Bestimmung wissen viele Mädchen nicht mehr wie sie damit umgehen sollen, und der Mann bekommt immer mehr Macht. In ihrer emotionalen Verwundbarkeit wird dieses Verhalten von den Mädchen als „normal“ abgespeichert und genau daraus entstehen dann Gewaltbeziehungen.

Cool: Was meinen Sie mit „emotionaler Verwundbarkeit“?

Mag.a Maria Rösslhumer: In der Pubertät, wenn die ersten Beziehungen und Dates stattfinden, sind Mädchen in einer Phase, in der sie auch sehr stark einem Gruppenzwang ausgesetzt sind. Da heißt es oft von Seiten der Freundinnen oder der Burschen, dass man das und das machen muss, um dazuzugehören. Unsere Erfahrungen haben gezeigt, dass Mädchen speziell in diesem Alter sehr unsicher sind und oftmals Dinge über sich ergehen lassen oder machen, die sie selbst eigentlich gar nicht möchten. Die erste Verliebtheitsphase ist bei Mädchen eine sehr heikle Phase und von vielen Ängsten geprägt – sie wollen nichts falsch machen, wollen den Freund nicht verlieren und tun sich dann schwer Nein zu sagen.

Mädchen müssen lernen, Stopp zu sagen wenn aus ihrer Sicht Grenzen überschritten werden.

Cool: Das erinnert mich sehr an unser voriges Interview, in dem uns Sexualpädagoge Mag

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. Wolfgang Kostenwein erzählt hat, dass Sex nur Sex ist, wenn beide Seiten Lust verspüren und man ansonsten Nein sagen sollte…

Mag.a Maria Rösslhumer: Gewalt an jungen Frauen und Mädchen ist, egal in welcher Form, sehr häufig an etwas Sexuelles geknüpft. Diese Aussage aus dem Interview stimmt absolut, also wenn etwas wehtut oder man etwas tun muss, das man selbst nicht tun möchte, dann sollte man als Frau sofort aufhören. Viele Burschen haben leider nie gelernt, dass es zum Sex auch gehört, die Partnerin zu fragen, was sie gerne möchte. Bei dieser Kommunikation tun sich schon Erwachsene sehr schwer und Jugendliche, die durch Erzählungen von Freunden oder durch Pornos viele falsche Inputs bekommen, aber selbst noch keine Erfahrung haben, umso mehr.

Cool: Ohne zu viel über Sex zu reden, aber inwiefern spielen auch Porno-Praktiken wie Würgen eine Rolle?

Mag.a Maria Rösslhumer: Keine Frau will beim Sex geschlagen oder gewürgt werden! Und wenn, dann häufig nur, weil sie selbst schon Gewalterfahrungen gemacht und dieses Verhalten fälschlicherweise als „normal“ abgespeichert hat. Das sind Pornos und Männerfantasien, aber kein Mensch möchte so behandelt werden und schon gar nicht vom eigenen Liebespartner. Hier muss man sehr vorsichtig sein, was man zulässt, weil das ansonsten auch für den Beziehungsalltag und die eigene Sexualität gefährlich werden kann.

Cool: Wie geht man als betroffenes Mädchen am besten damit um?

Mag.a Maria Rösslhumer: Der wichtigste Grundsatz ist: Ein Nein muss immer akzeptiert werden, egal was vorher gesagt wurde und das gilt nicht nur beim Sex, sondern ganz generell! Mädchen müssen lernen, Stopp zu sagen wenn aus ihrer Sicht Grenzen überschritten werden. Je früher sich Mädchen an Hilfe wenden, desto besser. Sobald man erste Warnzeichen erkennt, das Gespräch mit der besten Freundin nicht mehr reicht und man nicht weiß was man tun soll, sollte man unbedingt professionelle Beratung suchen. Zum Beispiel können sich die Mädchen bei der Frauenhelpline 0800/222 555 melden.

Cool: Provokativ gefragt: Tragen Mädchen manchmal nicht auch eine Mitschuld?

Mag.a Maria Rösslhumer: Man ist nie selbst schuld. Egal, ob man sich als Mädchen sexy kleidet, aufreizende Fotos postet oder übertrieben gesagt, selbst wenn man nackt auf die Straße läuft, es hat dennoch niemand das Recht deshalb sexuell übergriffig zu werden. Natürlich wollen junge Frauen den Burschen gefallen, sie suchen Bestätigung und tun dabei Dinge, deren Auswirkungen sie noch nicht richtig einschätzen können, aber sie sind trotzdem kein Freiwild. Ein knackiger Po ist schön anzuschauen, aber keine Einladung!

Cool: Warum sind manche Jungs überhaupt gewalttätig zu Frauen?

Mag.a Maria Rösslhumer: Das hat natürlich viel damit zu tun wie man aufgewachsen ist. Burschen, die Machoverhalten, Übergriffe und Gewalt von Zuhause kennen, glauben oft, dass das normal ist. Und wenn so jemand in seiner Clique dann vorgibt, dass es cool ist, Frauen schlecht zu machen, als Huren zu bezeichnen und zu erniedrigen, dann bekommt das schnell eine Eigendynamik. Wenn man hingegen gelernt bekommt, dass man gegenüber einer Frau nicht die Hand erhebt und respektvoll und liebevoll miteinander umgeht, wird es mit hoher Wahrscheinlichkeit nie ein Problem geben. Vorleben ist ganz wichtig und deshalb sollten sich Burschen auch nicht von einem Negativbeispiel beeinflussen lassen, sondern demjenigen stattdessen sagen, dass es eben nicht cool ist, eine Frau oder ein Mädchen so zu behandeln.

© Lizz Sator/Prontolux

Das ist „Tabulos“
Zugegeben, dieses Interview war nicht geplant, vor allem nicht so kurz nach dem zweiteiligen Sex-Interview, das in gewissen Passagen ein paar Ähnlichkeiten zum neuen „Tabulos“ aufweist. Nachdem ich allerdings vom AÖF, dem Verein Autonome Österreichische Frauenhäuser, die Presseaussendung zur Kampagne „16 Tage gegen Gewalt an Frauen und Mädchen“ bekommen hatte, war für mich klar, dass ich unbedingt ein Interview mit Mag.a Maria Rösslhumer machen möchte. Aus ihrem Rückruf bezüglich meiner Anfrage wurde dann spontan gleich das Interview selbst, da sie so viel zu erzählen hatte beziehungsweise mich die Thematik auch schockiert und fasziniert hat. Lest bitte bis zum Schluss und behaltet das Interview für eure Zukunft in Erinnerung – egal ob ihr Mädchen oder Burschen seid. (Daniel Gräbner)